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Post by andycole on Feb 16, 2006 11:18:33 GMT 2
Gentlemen, Andy, not sure why I need to point this out to you, since, for the most part, you seem to be a pretty bright guy, and it's not rocket science, but anyway, here it goes: my examples ARE of scenarios where the BIN was later added, so no, YOU are wrong! Paul, dude, there is way too much to comment on, but I'll tell you this, this $60 figure that has lit a fire under everyone's ass, is what he came up with, not me! AC Well, Aris, can you PROVE that those previous items that got compliments to the buyers were added BIN's? I can assure you that the 'nice swipe' boxed judge was an ebay store item, so it would have been a BIN from the start. And the seller of the mario bros has told us that you made the first ridiculous offer for the game, so that's put paid to your 'defence' A couple of other comments about things mentioned in this thread..... Yes, technically the seller has breached ebay's rules by pulling out of a finished auction. Good luck with that!! Also, Slash, it is against ebay's rules to notify bidders of your 'similar' items while an auction is running. I believe they call it bid siphoning. One last thing.... Mike, I appreciate your tactful response as to why your crew is doing this, but let's not kid ourselves, if it wasn't my ID that won it, this would never have happened. And it especially wouldn't happen if it were any of your 'IN' crowd. 'fraid you're wrong again. The request to inform the seller from Fox was 4 posts before I mentioned who you were. Andy.
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Post by foxterrier2000 on Feb 16, 2006 11:59:20 GMT 2
Aris, Grow up and get a life, Seriously. You cannot compare your Mario Bros and my Blackjack together, Since they were under completely different circumstances.
Once the Blackjack had intrest from another bidder, I requested that the seller disregard my request for a BIN and continue the auction normally. She then, without warning, sent me two messages a few hours later requesting me to purchase it. I paid a fair price for it, Which the seller set and not myself, Opposed to the ridiculous $40 offer you made. That was simply the luck of the draw.
I am a collector, and you are a reseller. I have seen time and time again you trying to obtain carded/sealed games for a tiny BIN cost, and reselling for hundreds of dollars profit.
I honestly can't be bothered to read all the pages before, So I am just typing this message in my own defence. I have no regrets for informing the seller, and in reality I do not think EBAY would side with you, Since they would have lost quite a bit in fees if your BIN deal had gone through.
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Post by Br3nd4N on Feb 16, 2006 12:49:00 GMT 2
Bid siphoning ay, sorry don't see it as anything wrong, all I'm suggesting is there may be a better deal elsewhere, or post fact, all is not lost, there is another item avaliable, and I never offer an item of less value than the one they are bidding/bid on.
At best ebay could say is I'm possibly using there system to get customers, and they may not get there commission. It's not "ethically" wrong it's just ebay does not like it.
Hell if you want to sell your house, best way.... find an open home in your area, with a simillar house and hand out flyers to potential buyers leaving the property... is that worng? you make your own mind up....
-B
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Post by andycole on Feb 16, 2006 13:03:43 GMT 2
I wasn't saying it was right or wrong, I was just pointing out the fact that it's against ebay's rules. More so than asking a seller to add a BIN price LOL!
Andy.
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Post by wwfcgoober on Feb 16, 2006 14:09:10 GMT 2
I'm not really interested in getting involved in all the nonsense going on here, but just a quick note for Slash so as you don't do anything which could find yourself in trouble.
The following is an excerpt from ebays miscellaneous offence pages:
Miscellaneous offences:
Bid siphoning - Emailing another sellers' bidders and offering the same or similar items
I'm not having a go at you or anything like that, just trying to help out a fellow Australian.
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Post by rob-catron on Feb 16, 2006 14:41:45 GMT 2
There's always 2 sides to a story. Thanks for sharing the other side. Also, I'm sure it will be a long time coming before you accept another outside offer. Hope it all goes well. TBW. P.S. You shouldn't double post . Edit your previous post. Whoops, sorry about the newbie double-post - and thanks for the kind words. I did just want to point out that concerning losing one's Power Sellers Status, losing one's account, getting "law enforcement" involved, etc... There are two types of eBay violoations (I am sure you all are aware of this): What are called "Severe" and regular (for lack of a better term) eBay policies. If you violate a "severe" policy within 60 days -- it is one strike and you are out (PS Status, suspension, etc) They are as follows: 1. shill bidding 2. unwelcome bidder and malicious buying 3. site interference 4. Section 9 (fraud) 5. transaction interference 6. User Agreement violations that are not list practices Non-Performing seller falls under the following, I do not like to say, "normal" (basically list practices) which, fall into the criteria of 3 strikes in a 60 day period and you are out. Now, if the non-performing seller accepts payment for the item, then does not ship the item, this of course would fall under fraud, and a buyer can file an eBay Dispute, otherwise, the buyer fills out the non-performing seller report (which are not the same two things). I have personally have never had any eBay violations in my past. I guess I started on eBay in 2001 or so, I'm not really sure. I'll let you all be the judge, as you know the circumstances, and I would appreciate comments. Of course, from my point of view, an attempt of a buyer to 'steal' (I know, I know, harsh words) an item from a seller falls into Severe items 2, 3, and possibly 5, but I know it does not work like that. To me, "ethics" and "rules" do not always equal the same things. Just because a buyer tricks someone into a BIN, and follows eBay's rules does not make that trick ethical. Now, of course, to the winning buyer, the seller who gets mad because they fell for the trick, and refuses to sell the item is unethical because they broke the eBay rule. This is an area where there will be a lot of passionate debate and disagreement on, I totally understand. Sincerely, Rob-Catron
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Post by swedengame on Feb 16, 2006 14:42:22 GMT 2
Hell if you want to sell your house, best way.... find an open home in your area, with a simillar house and hand out flyers to potential buyers leaving the property... is that worng? you make your own mind up.... -B But is the house sold when they leave the property? Otherwise you're just using the poor guy who actually did advertise his house... And BTW, you said that you offered before ending. So isn't that like handing out flyers on their way in.... And yes, I have made my mind up.
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Post by devster on Feb 16, 2006 15:59:05 GMT 2
Yeah Brendan, pay up and use your own agent, you freeloader!!!
Rob, thanks for your comments. This is a passionate thing and the very issue that has been raised here over the last few days will evoke some strong reaction.
It’s a hard call; two wrongs don't make a right and all that!
I think that it is clear that you have every right to be upset. Aris might have withheld information, but is he obliged to give it to you, isn't it your responsibility to find out the value?
If he told you it was only worth $60, then that's different and bad! - But then again, we say buyer beware! How about sellers beware!!
I mean if you were going to sell your house, you wouldn't guess the price, you'd get a value. And because you know it's worth something. With the Mario you didn't!
I think sometimes there is lethargy on this board and Aris comments can hold weight due to that. There is not enough consistency.
Correct me if I am wrong, whilst some voiced their concerns over Pat's Blackjack situation, did any of you email the seller to tell them how much they should have expected?
Also if Aris offered $40 and Rob said no I'll take $60, (Rob, please advise) then that's not so different from Pat's situation. Pat made a request to BIN, but then let it ride when outside interest came in. The seller then gave him a price he was happy with and Pat accepted. It all depends if the price Pat paid was a fair one or not, if it wasn’t (i.e. $100) then I would say both situations are the same and both took advantage (Pat, I don't know the ins and out's of your case and I'm not trying to accuse you of anything, I'm just making an example).
Anyway, I'll stop before you all go to sleep again!
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Post by sAner on Feb 16, 2006 18:17:04 GMT 2
I think you're all a bunch of dishonest bastards! ;D
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Post by devster on Feb 16, 2006 18:39:25 GMT 2
how true!!! :mexican:
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Post by mpanayiotakis on Feb 16, 2006 20:22:12 GMT 2
Firstly, those do-gooders who contacted the seller and gave him my whole lifetime history on this forum, get a life! I wanted to comment on that because I think that this is outrageous. Noone can use this board's posts in order to defame a user!! I've written about it some time ago when Nelson used to do the same thing in his auctions. This is no different! And just because Aris has some differences with people in here, doesn't mean we should use these against him! I hope this won't be repeated!! Really ? Then, obviously you don't read the posts very carefully. I can remember at least 3 other cases in the last 2 months and one of them as I mentioned was Pat. Needless to say that I know Pat since I started collecting and still I had to complain to him about it. Now, about buying duplicates or more of each item, I'm against it, unless you just want to upgrade your collection or fill you shipping boxes which I've done in the past. In the former case, the extra items should be sold as I've done for the past 3 years. I don't know why other people like Kevin keep so many items. Don't they want the extra money ? Who knows ? Michael
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Post by sAner on Feb 16, 2006 21:00:58 GMT 2
Hmmm ... I know that what I am going to write now, won't make me popular ... but I'll have a go anyway. Remember that this is just my 2 cents! ;D Of course it's unfair to trick a buyer into selling way below the going rate and pursuading him to put a ridiculously low BIN on an item, but how is it any different from using an unbelievably low existing BIN? When pursuading a seller into putting a low BIN on an item is wrong, then you shouldn't use a low existing BIN either. If you are really THAT ethical, then you should contact the seller (instead of using the low existing BIN), tell him about the real value and pursuade him into removing the low BIN or put a higher BIN on the item instead and then use it. Ridiculous eh? People already wrote it before me; life isn't fair. Point. Face it. And there is nothing you are going to change about it. Life is a bi-tch and then you die. It's dog eat dog out there and if a seller is stupid enough to sell for a meager price, why shouldn't you take advantage? Because it is unfair for the seller? Tough luck! Better pay attention or you get screwed. Did you miss that lesson on school? Or shouldn't you take advantage because it is unfair to the other collectors who are thousands of miles away from you and who are in fact just i-net identities to you? Get real! And if you are really THAT ethical, shouldn't you all put BINs on your own auctions? BIN's as high as the going rate? It's really unfair that you misuse the auction-system and try to get the most out of an item. Also; why shouldn't you buy multiple games? Is there a law against it? If you would like to buy 100 pocketsize Mario Bros's, you have every right to do so. Why not? Because other people can't buy one then? They can, they just have to outbid you. And then resellers ... God knows I detest them ... but can they do it? Of course they can. Why not? Can anyone explain? What law forbids reselling? Just my 2 cents of course! And how about all the people that don't have lots of $$$$$, what are they to do? This could be the only way to get the games you want. S*h*i*t happens all the time and we all need to learn to deal with it. Basically everyone is up in arms about this not because they feel sorry for the seller, but because they are f*cked off they didn't get it. 100% true. Couldn't have said it better. sAner
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Post by Gamewatchcollector on Feb 16, 2006 21:17:01 GMT 2
[/quote] Now, about buying duplicates or more of each item, I'm against it, unless you just want to upgrade your collection or fill you shipping boxes which I've done in the past. In the former case, the extra items should be sold as I've done for the past 3 years. I don't know why other people like Kevin keep so many items. Don't they want the extra money ? Who knows ? Michael [/quote] Hey Michael, It depends on the different multiples that I own-for example, the (4) DKII PS is to fill up my shipping box along with the regular DKII, multiples that incl. Oil Panic, DK, Mickey & Donald, Mario Bros., etc are simply different variations, and (2) Parachute PS - I plan to trade 1 for other items later. As for MTJ, it's a different story as it's the last G&W and I just love the different heading, colorful box, etc while my (2) Boxed ones contain different sets of manuals Kevin
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Post by Aris on Feb 16, 2006 22:54:45 GMT 2
See, I've made the forum interesting again!
JWTW, Liar? Based on what? You really should find out about things before flapping those big fat lips of yours! I noticed you selling some games lately, are you making a profit on them? Did you buy them from someone who didn't know the true value of them, and offer them fair market value for them? Yeah, I'm sure you did!
Mike, in your 3 cases, was there an e-mail in your forum that suggested people contact the seller at will? Did at least 3 people contact the seller and plant the seed of doubt? Did they include auction listings showing what the game is worth and tell some complete stranger the buyer's history in your forum? I severely doubt it! Sure, he's a member here now, but it's obvious he doesn't belong, he knows nothing about the games, other than what his new friends told him. Talk about sticking out like a sore thumb!
As for the duplicates, again, people can do whatever they want, there's no law that says they can't collect more than one of each game, and more importantly, there is no ebay policy against it. My point is, your concern about why the BIN method I used is frowned upon, is ridiculous since 'these collectors' that are not able to complete their collections because of 'my BIN practices' are suffering way more from the 'multiple game buyers' than from early BIN winners. And you know that.
As for the rest of you who still can't see straight, I don't know how many times I have to explain this to you, Rob came up with the $60 not me! I offered him $40, he countered with $60, I accepted. Where's the problem here? Does anyone here let the seller know what the market value is of a game before they bid or make an offer for it? Didn't think so.
'nuf said.
AC
PS Read below and you tell me who the liar is! At least we all now know what it means when Rob says 'we have a deal'!
====================================================================== Response to Question about Item -- Respond Now ======================================================================
Response from rob-catron ---------------------------------------
Item: 1983 Nintendo MARIO BROS Pocketsize GAME & Watch BOXED! (8259295035) This message was sent while the listing was active. rob-catron is the Seller. --------------------------------------- Greetings from Kentucky. $60 US including airmail letter post shipping, and we have a deal. I know this one, along with my feedbacks and reputation will go pretty high.
Sincerely, and thank you for the interest Rob Catron
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Post by rob-catron on Feb 16, 2006 23:19:12 GMT 2
PS Read below and you tell me who the liar is! At least we all now know what it means when Rob says 'we have a deal'! ====================================================================== Response to Question about Item -- Respond Now ====================================================================== Response from rob-catron --------------------------------------- Item: 1983 Nintendo MARIO BROS Pocketsize GAME & Watch BOXED! (8259295035) This message was sent while the listing was active. rob-catron is the Seller. --------------------------------------- Greetings from Kentucky. $60 US including airmail letter post shipping, and we have a deal. I know this one, along with my feedbacks and reputation will go pretty high. Sincerely, and thank you for the interest Rob Catron I never said anything otherwise about the $60 number being mine -- so how can you say that it is I who is the liar? Ask the 2,605 satified recipients of any of my goods on eBay if they can trust Rob-Catron to a Deal!!!As I said before, you are using this as your way of justifying your actions. Let's say we Had a deal, until I learned of your trick. Here is the first email recieved that started this whole trick, and one that I should have said, "NO" to: Item: 1983 Nintendo MARIO BROS Pocketsize GAME & Watch BOXED! (8259295035) This message was sent while the listing was active. v6b is a potential buyer. Hello,
I'll offer you $40 via 'buy it now'. Sincerely, Rob
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