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Post by ash888 on Mar 25, 2012 3:08:25 GMT 2
Flo's G&W book states, or at least implies, that Egg was released in Europe and North America. I was under the impression that Egg was only intended to be released in Australia due to copyright issues with Disney.
Here is the excerpt from page 75, paragraphs 2-3, regarding Egg:
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"In 1981, when Nintendo asked Disney for the publication rights of the Mickey Mouse character on an international scale, the company only got the rights to use the character in Japan! It was a rival toy company that got the rights for the western market. Gunpei Yokoi and his team were then forced to change their game for a European and North American release."
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Maybe something happened afterwards, which resulted in Egg only being released in Australia, because we know there is a Pocketsize Mickey Mouse that was released in North America. But if this bit of information is true, it increases the remote possibility that a PS Egg was released.
Flo, if you're reading this, could you provide your sources for this info? Also, who was the "rival toy company" mentioned above?
Finally, can anyone provide a reputable source stating that Egg was only released in Australia, or is this just "word on the street" information?
Thanks!
Ash
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Post by andycole on Mar 26, 2012 15:24:30 GMT 2
Finally, can anyone provide a reputable source stating that Egg was only released in Australia, or is this just "word on the street" information? Thanks! Ash With all due respect to Flo, just about everything we know, including stuff printed in the book, is just 'word on the street' isn't it? I've said this for years, facts and figures we quote as 'facts' are just things we've heard and passed on over the years. I think that the number of truly proveable facts are quite low in comparison to the 'word on the street facts'. Just my opinion. Andy.
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Post by ash888 on Mar 27, 2012 5:35:20 GMT 2
With all due respect to Flo, just about everything we know, including stuff printed in the book, is just 'word on the street' isn't it? I've said this for years, facts and figures we quote as 'facts' are just things we've heard and passed on over the years. I think that the number of truly proveable facts are quite low in comparison to the 'word on the street facts'. Just my opinion. Andy. Well, I was hoping he based this information on some sort of source, since I believe he has some connections with Nintendo. I checked the page on Mickey Mouse (page 74) and it says: ----------- "This G&W [Mickey Mouse] would only be released later on the western market, most importantly, after another G&W game: 'Egg'." ----------- Ash
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Post by Aris on Mar 31, 2012 5:52:06 GMT 2
Finally, can anyone provide a reputable source stating that Egg was only released in Australia, or is this just "word on the street" information? Thanks! Ash With all due respect to Flo, just about everything we know, including stuff printed in the book, is just 'word on the street' isn't it? I've said this for years, facts and figures we quote as 'facts' are just things we've heard and passed on over the years. I think that the number of truly proveable facts are quite low in comparison to the 'word on the street facts'. Just my opinion. Andy. This is my understanding as well. I mean, I don't go as far back as Andy and Mike when it comes to this forum, and while I believe Mike was able to get some data and pictures from Nintendo, I'm not so sure anyone has been in a position to compile data about G&W through an actual legitimate contact (employee - former or current) at Nintendo. Having said that, wasn't it Florent that revealed information on the 20,000,000 Green House Special along the lines of only 50 of them being made and that Gunpei made them kinda incognito without the blessings of the powers that be at Nintendo? And that he gave them to very close friends and family only??? Regarding the news about Mickey Mouse, am I the only one that finds it strange that Florent is being vague about this? "A rival toy manufacturer" What's up with that? All along, the general understanding has been what Eric has mentioned - Disney forbade the Mickey Mouse game from being released in certain countries. The most popular being Australia. As a result, Egg was created, and released in this "forbidden" countries. But then, I seem to recall a few instances where Egg showed up for sale in the USA, and not from a collector, but, from an average joe resident of the US. So, it begs the question, how did this "Australian-only" (and possible certain Asian countries) released game show up in the US? Was it released there, or was it brought there? Looking at the Serial Number Database, the three earliest serial numbers we have for Egg are: 05753264 06019496 06812669 The first two appear out of place, as there are quite a few more 068xxxxx numbers, but only one 057xxxxx and one 060xxxxx number. The three earliest serial numbers we have for Mickey Mouse are: 06369335 06373653 06530672 This may be a bit of a stretch, especially since the database obviously doesn't represent even 1% of all the games ever produced, but, if these numbers are correct, based on the data we have so far, it would almost appear as if Egg was produced BEFORE Mickey Mouse. It would be nice if Florent did visit here and made a point of addressing some of our concerns. Especially since a good chunk, if not the majority, of any income he's making form sale of these books, is from members of this forum, and a lot of free word of mouth advertising originates here too. Perhaps some of the French collectors here can get in touch with the France-based Florent, and let him know we have questions, and would love to have him visit here and try to address the questions we have. Heck, it might be good to do an old time interview, like sAner and Mike did in the past with guys like Taki and Paul! Fredolococo? Maxime?? Greggpaea??? Garfn7? Phiphirenaud? ? Or anyone else I missed. Can you guys try your luck with Mr. Georges? AC
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Post by greggpaea on Mar 31, 2012 13:58:09 GMT 2
i will send him a email but i dont all understand.....you want make a interview with Flo? how make this? i will ask Flo if he can connecting in the forum,but i dont sure he do that ,because i proposed Flo (a few month ago) to visiting us in french's g&w forum.....but he never visit again........think he is busy... maybe it is better to prepare a questions,and i will send him.....? regards. GrEgg Aris: his name is Mr Gorges....
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Post by mpanayiotakis on Apr 1, 2012 21:20:30 GMT 2
This may be a bit of a stretch, especially since the database obviously doesn't represent even 1% of all the games ever produced, but, if these numbers are correct, based on the data we have so far, it would almost appear as if Egg was produced BEFORE Mickey Mouse. Aris I saw your post and I have to add a couple of things.. First of all Mickey Mouse and Egg were released simultaneously (according to official Nintendo release dates). Serial numbers mean nothing in this case because most batches of games were probably created before their release. Secondly, I don't see a point why Nintendo would release both games in a country since they're essentially the same game. No one would have bought Egg in this case. And even if you don't believe that Egg was released in Asia and Australia only, there's no denying that it was a limited release (acc. to production numbers, its rarity and facts mentioned above). Egg may have appeared elsewhere for sale and that can be attributed to unofficial imports or Nintendo's attempt to sell remaining stock at a later date. It wouldn't have been that uncommon.. Michael
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Post by ash888 on Apr 1, 2012 23:57:50 GMT 2
Well, if Flo's book is accurate on this point, it is possible that Mickey Mouse was released in Japan, while Egg was released for North America, Europe, etc. on the same date. But once permission was acquired from Disney to release Mickey Mouse in other countries, Nintendo transitioned from Egg to Mickey Mouse, and most likely halted production of Egg for those countries.
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Post by totaljapon on Apr 3, 2012 12:53:57 GMT 2
Hi Everybody, I'm Flo, the author of this Game & Watch history book. Greg told me you had some questions. ^^ I'll be very honored to answer to interviews, yes. Just PM me ! I'll try to give you the good information just like I got it during my investigation, about 5 years ago. ^^ Well, I'm sorry cause I can't give you the name of the old g&w staff who gave me those information but about Egg, he just told me : "Well, I really can't remember, so I may mistake myself. Forgive me, it's about 25 years ago... First, I remember we wanted to release Mickey Mouse worldwide but some rival companies got Disney's right before us for LCD games in some western countries. So, because the game concept was already done, we quickly created a new character, a wolf. And we realeased the Mickey Mouse game in Japan first and Egg in Foreign countries. But after some month, Disney's allowed us to release Mickey Mouse worldwide. So that's why we sold M.M everywhere..." That's all I know about this story. As you can read, my contact didn't mention "Australia only". BUT, you can trust me, he really wasn't sure of what they really did at that time. When some of you mention it was only available in Australia, you may be right ! My contact told me "the Disney rights were not available for foreign countries" but it also may be have told me "not available for Australia". That's a mystery, you're right. And I don't know if you will, one day, have the real reason of this mystery. People involved in the sells or creation of the G&W games at Nintendo are getting old and they can't remember all the details of each models... So, what I think : - Mickey Mouse : available in Japan and Nintendo wanted it Worldwide. - Egg : because of some rights problems, Egg was released in those countries instead of MM (just Australia, I don't know). - Disney, for some reason, gave the rights to Nintendo to release it in almost countries. So MM became popular and Egg, available in only few countries became so rare.
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Post by andycole on Apr 3, 2012 15:04:04 GMT 2
Based on all that, it would seem that the time period before Nintendo were able to release Mickey Mouse worldwide must have been quite short, otherwise Egg would be a LOT more common than it actually is, in fact, if the Disney problem had have gone on longer, it would have been Mickey Mouse that was the rare one and Egg the common one.
So, based on the assumption that the lifespan of Egg in the US (and elsewhere) was pretty short, we can begin to take slightly more educated guesses about whether a PS exists. In my mind, the possibility is there, because the information suggests that Egg did get released in the US. But for how long? Long enough for NOA to do a pocketsize version? We don't know. There was a thread long, long ago about whether PS versions were re-releases. Something to do with the nintendo logo being different..... I'm wondering if egg would have been withdrawn before PS even started shipping.
Of course, none of this helps us answer the question about Chef or Turtle Bridge!
Andy
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Post by ash888 on Apr 3, 2012 17:06:59 GMT 2
Hi Flo, thank you for visiting the forum and telling us about your source for the Egg history. And thanks Andy for your insights too. When I used to work for Namco Ltd. in Japan, I know that the main overseas markets focused on were North America and Europe, with Europe usually getting a release delay of several months to a year after North America for various localization reasons. However, the Australian market was never talked about when discussing overseas sales. I asked one of my more experienced colleagues, who is Australian, why we never discuss the Australian market, and he told me in jest it's because there are only about 5 PlayStations in the entire country. So with Australia being a fairly minor market, we have to ask ourselves, would Nintendo take the time and effort of making an entirely new character and altering their game just to make up for a few missed sales in Australia? I say probably not, although it's possible. What I bet happened was the copyrights were obtained for the US and Europe to use Mickey Mouse, cutting distribution of Egg in those regions short, and maybe the life of Egg was longer in Australia for whatever legal reasons, hence the unsourced "common knowledge" that Egg is an Australian release. There is a picture of a Futuretronics Mickey Mouse in Flo's book, so we know Mickey was eventually sold there too. I have had some interactions with the NOA people I was talking about earlier, but I don't want to discuss it here yet until I know the answers to the big questions. ;D Hopefully, I'll know something this week or the next. Ash
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Post by totaljapon on Apr 4, 2012 10:16:49 GMT 2
I think Ash888 is quite right. I don't believe that Nintendo would make such an effort just for a "little" market. The point is that Nintendo was not as big and strong than today.
But what I believe about the EGG mystery is : The concept of Mickey Mouse was firstly created. But because Nintendo worked with foreigner toy distributors at that time (JI21, tricotronic, CGL), Nintendo noticed that that Mickey Mouse licence wasn't available for all the countries. So, at the same time, they created a new character (with the same gameplay/story concept) to be sure to give new models to their partners. They also were released EGG at the same time and all the Nintendo's partners could pick up what they want from the G&W new models catalogue.
And if you watch at the Nintendo history, Donkey Kong has a quite similar story. They wanted to make a Popeye game for the US market but they just can't. So they put new character in the game who became Donkey, Mario and so on. So, with this Mickey Mouse, it's a matter of market where they have (or not) the rights for a Disney LCD game. And all after that, the reality is that just Australia market needed Egg at that time ? After some month (or year ?), Futuretronics make that Mickey Mouse in Australia possible ?
Well, it's my personnal opinion and not an official story. ^^
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Post by ash888 on May 10, 2012 20:56:02 GMT 2
I have had some interactions with the NOA people I was talking about earlier, but I don't want to discuss it here yet until I know the answers to the big questions. ;D Hopefully, I'll know something this week or the next. Ash Hi folks, Just an update about my interactions with the NOA people. I was able to buy some PS games from them. The first guy I bought from claims his friend, who repaired G&W at NOA for a living from 1983 to who knows when, apparently has all the PS/NOA games ever made in his collection. But getting any information about Turtle Bridge, Chef, and Egg has been really difficult. For some reason, they won't give me an answer on it. So unfortunately, it's still up in the air. Not all hope is lost, although I'm getting next to no response from them now. Sorry to get everyone's hopes up... Ash
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Post by jbthechef on May 17, 2012 7:13:04 GMT 2
Thanks ash for your time and effort to get to the bottom of the mystery of the pocketsizes. JB
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